Recycled water

[here fishie fishie]

[quote:988debad0f]You actually shower??? and still smell like that???[/quote:988debad0f]
I know Steve bad aye, :?  I told ya the smell of chlorine is strong, unless its the smell of young lambs? :roll:

Heres a an interesting read, more about costs involved in Sydney when they looked at options last year.{De Sal}
http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/its-a-waste-seawater-not-the-solution/2005/11/24/1132703316740.html
[quote:988debad0f]Desal will wreck the marine ecology in the affected areas in the long term.[/quote:988debad0f] How? Australia is flanked by a number of major sea currents. Water on the planet always continues to circulate, through rivers, soil, air & atmosphere.

There are more than 7,500 desalination plants operate worldwide, with two-thirds of them in the Middle East.
Link to new technology,{Dec 04}
The plant on the Coast will use reverse osmosis.
http://news.ufl.edu/2004/12/16/desal/
[quote:988debad0f]Reverse osmosis uses less energy but has other problems, including mineral buildup clogging the filters.[/quote:988debad0f]
Good on them for trying the cheapest option, it's like Beatie wants De sal, to fail so he can say I told ya so. We aren't going to use the best technology available, what the :?:

With recycled water are Prozac, Norvasc, all the Pharamacy drugs & personal care products complete eliminated? Alot of drugs are used now days.
[quote:988debad0f]The authorities who supply our reticulated drinking water are very good at removing particulate matter and all infectious agents - bacteria, viruses and parasites. Its ionic content can be reduced by reverse osmosis to 'soften' it. What is far more difficult to remove however are dissolved organic chemicals - these require passage through activated carbon filters for their removal.

Chemicals such as pesticides, detergents and plasticisers are present in waste water. In the human body these chemicals mimic the activity of the female hormone oestrogen. Added to this there is in waste water all the normally excreted female urinary oestrogens and those added by contraceptive and hormone replacement pill usage.

The concern is that these chemicals may not be removed from water that is being recycled. It is thought that their ingestion by pregnant women and young male children may have a deleterious effect on the reproductive organs and urinary tract of developing male babies and children.

The evidence comes from apparently greater rates of falling sperm counts in industrialised countries which heavily recycle water, along with increased rates of male genital tract abnormalities and testicular cancer. All we have however is a strong association – not a proven cause and effect. It is backed up by evidence from animal species living in water polluted by these chemicals where we have seen feminisation of male seals, fish, alligators and seabirds.

[b:988debad0f]The quest for safe recycling of water is both admirable and necessary. Those who are advocating it however should be required to give us details of how they propose to remove organic chemicals from the recycled water and how they intend monitoring the effectiveness of the procedure.[/b:988debad0f][/quote:988debad0f]

Also would seed the clouds work here?

I try to look at both sides, I don't really know which is the best option. Way up cost of de sal versus how safe is recylced?

I am sure the poo option will effect Tourism. Some cultures will not drink poo water.

Frenchy :D

[Thanes]

Desal won't affect marine life in the long run??That's what they said about coal fired power plants,come to think of it they also said the same about dumping nuclear waste into the oceans.If every country started to use desal what woul the oceans be like then(an image of the dead sea comes to mind).What is probably the best is to use all options to a smaller degree,because if you use 1 option 100% there will be a backlash either public,tourism,economical,or natural.And the only things I've heard about the dams is what is said on the news,& I don't believe half of what those scare mongers say.But like braddo said if the soil wont hold water why put a dam there,& if it's going to be shallow why make another North Pine dam cause it costs too much to run that because it's too shallow.
Cheers Brian.

Are people really that ignorant and stupid, there is no way in 100years that desal will kill off wildlife, we are talking about the ocean here, this is not dry salt being dumped back into the water, is desolved salt, and the current will take it away, and you will drink the water, which from what i know doesnt taste like salt at all, you will then piss on a fence post it will evaporate and then rain back into the ocean like it has for a billion years.

Who is that nieve that they dont think all water is recycled, Maybe people who buy .........evein.

[Thanes]

Then what is this post for grum.the answer is simple just wait till it rains.
Cheers Brian.

[here fishie fishie]

:lol: at Gummy, so true. Look at the dams now, they would have some forms of recycled waste too. Agriculture run off, fish poo, the odd pee over the side of the boat, the odd dumped body, stray cow....

Frenchy :D

[Savage_roo]

I have lived in this area for most ove my life
and i can rember when the counsal
Discuraged the use of tank water so they could charge you for town water
So looks like we have come back around again

So  a bit of forward thinking would of saved a lot of people from refitting tanks to there homes
Well if they want to do it right
all thay have to do is to pump the water in to a march area and the let nature filter  it for us

Andrew

[zoezealand]

doesn't most waste water end up in the see anyway?

how would desal effect sea salt concentrations, cuz people would use the desal water, this waste water would then go back to the ocean diluting it slightly, canceling out any minimal effect of adding salt through waste desal, the sea level would not drop, so what ever you take out would be put back, just in 2 seperate pipes, salty waste, and used fresh

I hope that made sense
Kathryn

[ancalimon]

[quote:692568766c="zoezealand"]doesn't most waste water end up in the see anyway?

how would desal effect sea salt concentrations, cuz people would use the desal water, this waste water would then go back to the ocean diluting it slightly, canceling out any minimal effect of adding salt through waste desal, the sea level would not drop, so what ever you take out would be put back, just in 2 seperate pipes, salty waste, and used fresh

I hope that made sense
Kathryn[/quote:692568766c]

Out of interest, the Del Sal Plant will be the next project I get to start working on (in November ... fingers crossed).  It will be a glorified giant RO plant.  So the 4% salts will be reduced to 0.1% (or thereabouts in "broad brush wave your hands around in the air" terms) so the water returned to the South Pacific Ocean (it isn't going into the bay) will be in the order of 8% or thereabouts.  Theorectically "twice" as salty as it started, but minor in the great scheme of things.  

WRT to the anology of carbon emitting power stations, the about of CO2 in the atmosphere since c.1900 has approximately doubled (again round figures, the real numbers are out in there in google land).  It is very doubtful (but theoretically possible...) that all the De Sal plants in the world could double ocean salinity.  Mind you the ocean doesn't seem to mind having massive evaporation occuring at the same time...

caio
Graeme

[here fishie fishie]

Yep Kath all made sense.  It all goes around in circles, just as Grummy said. Look at it this way too, about 97% of water on the planet is salt.

Even the newspapers are one eyed on this, appearing to be recycled option only. A paper had an article about California & how it uses re cycling. Yet it didn't mention anything about how Florida using de-sal.

Frenchy :D

[GTR73]

[quote:36c3bf7478="Paulibius"]Not realy what you guys are talking about. But can we as fish keepers recycle our water any way efeectively and cost efficiently instead of dumping down the drain. I run afew tanks and would like to recycle my waste water if its possible.

Cheers Paul.[/quote:36c3bf7478]

I've wondered that myself over the years Paul. I actually pour all my old tank water on my plants and lawn so I guess I recycle. But you raise a good point.

Essentially, we only do water changes to remove a build up of NO3 (Nitrates) right? So I wonder if a large planted tank put to one side for recycling tank water might work? (However I'm not really knowledgeable about planted systems so not sure what would be produced). But I'm also thinking you'd have to examine what other benefits does fresh water from the tap have, and is it feasible to recreate that from your own recycled tank water?  :roll:
Regardless any recycled system would involve having all the test kits and your salt/buffer additives etc on hand.

Over the years I reckon availability of water resources will only get worse, so all fishkeepers will have to start looking at their options in this regard.  :?

[waahoo]

ive got a mate who aomes from a communist country. and 1 thing i have learnt from him is that at least his country wont die of thirst.

in his country if the government wants recycled water they get it! none of these bloody protesters.

in australia we will certainly have (Alert admin)s out there against any idea they come up with.
so my opinion is just F#@ken do it and tell the people to like it.

now i see the beauty in a communist way of life

[GTR73]

[quote:eb69d67cae="GTR73"][quote:eb69d67cae="Paulibius"]Not realy what you guys are talking about. But can we as fish keepers recycle our water any way efeectively and cost efficiently instead of dumping down the drain. I run afew tanks and would like to recycle my waste water if its possible.

Cheers Paul.[/quote:eb69d67cae]

I've wondered that myself over the years Paul. I actually pour all my old tank water on my plants and lawn so I guess I recycle. But you raise a good point.

Essentially, we only do water changes to remove a build up of NO3 (Nitrates) right? So I wonder if a large planted tank put to one side for recycling tank water might work? (However I'm not really knowledgeable about planted systems so not sure what would be produced). But I'm also thinking you'd have to examine what other benefits does fresh water from the tap have, and is it feasible to recreate that from your own recycled tank water?  :roll:
Regardless any recycled system would involve having all the test kits and your salt/buffer additives etc on hand.

Over the years I reckon availability of water resources will only get worse, so all fishkeepers will have to start looking at their options in this regard.  :?[/quote:eb69d67cae]


Err, maybe my planted tank idea might be a bit naive:

http://www.csd.net/~cgadd/aqua/art_plant_nitrate.htm

There'd be ways of recycling tank water, but cheaply at home is the real question.

[here fishie fishie]

[quote:15c10d89ea]in australia we will certainly have (Alert admin)s out there against any idea they come up with.
so my opinion is just F#@ken do it and tell the people to like it. [/quote:15c10d89ea]

 So does this communist country still have the majority of its people living in 3rd world conditions :?:

 I gave an option, care to note & read up if you like. The thing that gets me is that people are stupid enough to listen to any politican, newspaper...& take there few point as fact. We all watch programs & take note how often these guys lie to us  :roll: The recent employment ideas were great for the common man/lady too. :x
 De sal is the dearer option. Why would a politican choose that, it will end up costing eg; so taxes might go up, politicans won't risk that, they might get voted out, oh no!!! Look at the bid picture :roll:

 I heard Europe & USA mentioned. Look at Europe & USA, alot of the population live a distance form the coast line, so de sal isn't very viable & in some parts of the planet, the ocean isn't exactly safe to even swim in, let alone extract for drinking. :roll:  England, well we know how fickle they are when it comes to cost of money. Looks like they are more gullible than Wahoo.

 The Arab countries use de sal, parts of USA{Florida}... yes they are rich countries. They have easy access to salt water too. Yet i don't see Aussie struggling.  :lol: Look at what we pay in taxes, we are surrounded by water, most people live on the coast line too. :idea:  Why shouldn't we get the best our money can buy, we have paid for it. You get what you pay for  :lol:

 Aren't we meant to be Human beings? the superior race. Don't we deserve the best we can get especially when there are viable options. We aren't 3rd world, I will pay for water I don't care, in fact we are paying for water.  :roll:  I come from a wet country; yet as a school kid I was taught about the limited supply of fresh water & how valuable it is. This is a huge country prone to drought & those in power are a joke. Don't call us (Alert admin)s Wahoo, those that live in glass houses.... I think you are narrow minded & gullible.  :idea:

 Read up yourself & have a look. Why take a chance on our health if we don't have to? It is our well being after all. There are other options, for which I gave one. 7500 de sal plants are currently used in the world today, fact.
 We all keep fish too, therefore dosen't it look odd that when fish are caught in wild streams, that  they are noticing a sharp decline in males :?:

 Hey thats cool Wahoo, vote recycle. I will drink bottled water & if all our aquarium kept species turn out to be all girls I will know who to say, told ya so to.  :lol: {Last part was a joke, but could it happen}

 One final thing Wahoo, have a read of my signature. U (Alert admin).

Frenchy  :D

[waahoo]

Here fishie fishie,

i dont remember being rude towards you?
and from what i see from your avitar you are a sheep chaseR! so who are you to come here and drink our water?? HUH???  :evil:  

POP UP TO BRISABANE AND ILL SORT YOU OUT

[waahoo]

[quote:8374118e3c]One final thing Wahoo, have a read of my signature. U (Alert admin). [/quote:8374118e3c]

dude, your a fag.

maybe i might ride down to the coast and see ya,
i got some members down there.